“Man’s Best Friend with Benefits” Vide Clip

Are you a dog-lover who was disturbed by watching Sam slice open a Hellhound’s stomach and bathe in its blood? Well, next week’s episode shows Sam’s softer side when it comes to pooches. Sadly this clip does not mark the return of Riot, but we still see how much Sam loves dogs. Well, sort-of dogs.

News posted on February 14, 2013 Comments (80)


  1. I’d like to take a second to point out that the last episode was actually quite Dean heavy.
    It was all about Dean and Ellie. Dean and his sense of martyrdom.
    Sure, Sam is in for the trials, but purely as a vehicle to show Dean’s thoughts and emotions.
    So it’s nice that this will be a Sam episode.

    Comment by brx — February 14, 2013 @ 3:38 pm

  2. Brx: I cant help but disagree with you.
    Sam is in the trials for the arc of the plot.
    Dean is showing emotion for…what? For all that episode, all he did was raise his voice, pull out a gun and make some glasses.
    If the writers wanted Dean to have a role, they would have given him that knife and let him kill the hound. But look at the other thread with 94+ comments and read them all carefully. The writers give Sam almost every major arc. You cant deny it. Lets go with S6. Dean is a homely man, and Sam is back from the cage. Dean’s emotions do jack crap for the plot, and instead they explore why Sam isn’t “normal.” They hotfix that with Death, then explore the breaking of the wall.
    I put a more detailed post of it all up earlier, and I don’t wanna repeat myself.
    TL;DR: Dean is a wallflower and the writers all kiss their Sam posters at night before bed.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 14, 2013 @ 4:55 pm

  3. Yeah, it’s not like Dean had a year to live after a demon deal to save Sam.
    And it’s not like he was ever faced with the difficult decision to accept Michael’s possession.
    He was never in purgatory, either.
    Nor has he developed a special relationship with the reaper Tessa and death himself.
    Seriously, are we watching the same show? Both characters get plenty of love.

    Comment by brx — February 14, 2013 @ 5:15 pm

  4. That was hilarious! I can’t wait for the episode!

    Comment by Lisa1 — February 14, 2013 @ 5:28 pm

  5. I’m not saying Dean didn’t get a few moments of shining glory. Very few, though.
    Let me post my opinion on it, then open it for discussion:
    1)Dean’s demon deal. Overshadowed by Ruby offering to help. Ruby who was aiming to get Sam to go darkside. Bella, who was always a thorn in their side. Dean’s deal wasn’t even covered but in about 5 episodes. I’ll rewatch it, but I think that number is about right.

    2)His vessel role. It wasn’t revealed about them being vessels til S5. When it was, they both agreed to say no. So the angels kept pushing Dean, he kept saying no. The devil approached Sam, and he said no. A few times too. So the angels go for Adam instead, while the Devil stays on Sam. Why didn’t Satan go for Adam, and let the Angels keep tryin for Dean?

    3)Dean was in purgatory. And? What you mean is, he was in a forest with a vamp and an angel, and got out pretty quick from what they showed us. Neither of the brothers endured much while the other was away. The writers wrote in Benny to get Dean out, instead of letting Dean find his own creative way out. Again, if they expand that Purg story, then I’ll eat my words. Until then? Nope.

    4)Tessa? You mean the reaper we’ve seen what….3 or 4 times? Who adds NOTHING to the continuation of the plot? Exciting. Death? Saw him in S5, and we only got his ring by promising to do something involving Sam. Saw him in S6, once for a summon/binding, and once again for…Sam. To put in his soul. Hmm, seems like they are the best of chums, Dean and Death…

    5)We watch the same show. I never claimed to hate it. But Dean’s “roles”, if you will, add nothing to the plot, or continuation, of the story. Finding out about Sam and YED connection during 1-2, saving Dean (which IMO was overlooked) and stopping Sam from using his powers during 3, angel stories during 4, vessels (which again, they wrote off Dean for Adam) during 5, fixing Sam and getting his soul back/dealing with the wall, Eve, and the angel stuff during 6, Leviathans and Cas’s “redemption” by fixing Sam during 7, and now this mess during 8.

    I invite you, respectfully, of course, to point out where Dean had a MAJOR plot role in each season. I’ll give you S3 with him going to Hell. I wont take anything about him stopping Eve during s6, because I dont count her as a “big bad.” She was there for 2, 3 episodes? Cmon.

    I dont hate Sam. I really dont. But Dean gets no big plots for himself.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 14, 2013 @ 7:43 pm

  6. I’m going to throw my two-cents in on this discussion, since it’s been brought up here. Keep in mind that I am only discussing Dean’s role from a Dean-fan perspective and I’m only discussing what has gone on in S8 in the form of a brief summary.

    8.01 We Need to Talk About Kevin and 8.02 What’s Up, Tiger Mama introduced the first mytharc, the tablets, and Cas’ impending story about Naomi. Dean drags Sam back into hunting by simply reappearing in the story. Dean is shown to be the committed BA Hunter and Sam, the reluctant hero, who has found love and happiness in a normal life. 8.02 is the last time there is any hint at a PTSD story for Dean.

    8.03 Heartache and 8.04 Bitten are mytharc light, but are used to introduce the idea of the reluctant hero stepping up to the plate. Eleanor steps up and gives the brothers the information they need on who the bad gal is and Kate takes care of the werewolf problem and promises to be a good monster and live a normal, simple life.

    8.05 Blood Brother is Benny’s back story, but the perception of Dean as an uber-hunter is shown by Dean taking out an entire vamp nest, furthering the idea that he is now an awesome top-shelf hunter. Sam takes over the Benny storyline when he gets ticked off about Benny for inexplicable reasons.

    8.06 Southern Comfort: Garth is moved into Bobby 2.0. because ‘someone had to do it,’ again showing that ordinary…normal is the word the show uses…people sometimes have to step up to the plate. Garth saves Sam and lectures Dean (i.e., the audience) to accept Garth as the new Bobby, because he is just that adorable and he plays with sock puppets. The brothers relationship is fractured.

    8.07 A Little Slice of Kevin: Cas reappears as a recurring character, makes a demon kill and takes on Crowley. It’s revealed there is an angel tablet, which furthers Cas’ story. The biggest point made in the episode is that Cas tells Dean that he can’t save everybody and probably shouldn’t even be hunting everything out there.
    Half of the purpose of the Purgatory story ends here: Cas is back and his story introduced.

    8.08 Hunteri Heroici: The big reveal here is that Sam wanting a normal life is not his reality.

    8.09 Citizen Fang: This episode puts to bed for good the idea that Dean is some uber-hunter at the top of the hunting world. Again, he can’t get the job done and is saved by Benny. Sam carries the Benny story through his actions and the complete fracturing of the brother’s relationship.

    8.10 Torn and Frayed: The audience is reminded of two things: that Cas has a side story over here – something about tablets and the mysterious Naomi — and he brings the brothers back together to show the audience just how awesome the brothers are when they work as a team. Dean assumes all fault for the brothers fractured relationship. Sam chooses to hunt again, and Dean dumps Benny for the sake of solidarity with his brother.

    The Purgatory story ends with the healed brothers’ relationship. A minor sub-plot remains about what will be done with Benny – kill him off or keep him in the background to use again since he was a fan favorite.

    Purgatory and Benny were never Dean’s story – they were tools used to bring Sam back into the story as a reluctant hunter and Cas back as a recurring character (and get rid of the Crazy Cas that SG dreamed up). Dean being an uber-hunter was never Dean’s story, because he has more often than not been rescued by someone (Kevin in the 8.01 and 8.02, Sam in 8.03, knocked out by the ghost in 8.06, Cas in 8.07, Fred in 8.08, Benny in 8.09, Charlie in 8.11, Aaron in 8.13 and Sam in 8.14).

    8.11 LARP and the Real Girl: Charlie informs the audience, and Dean concedes for the second time, that he was at fault for causing all of angst and anger in the brothers’ relationship. Charlie, the reluctant hero, steps up to save the damsel in distress and the other reluctant hero, Sam, from being choked to death by a statue and not-uber-hunter Dean from being killed by a real sword. Sam lets Dean play at war and the brothers kiss and make up.

    8.12 As Time Goes By: Another mytharc introduced. Sam fully embraces this new mytharc by accepting Henry and his legacy, but Dean shows a lot of resistance to the idea. Henry saves the brothers by letting go of the past and putting his faith in his legacies – his grandsons.

    8.13 Everybody Loves Hitler: Sam fully embraces his legacy as a MoL and discovers his reason to hunt in the archives of knowledge. Dean excludes himself from the legacy and, thus, from that MoL storyline.

    8.14 Trial and Error (Swan Song II): Sam, the reluctant hero, accidently becomes the chosen one to close the gates of hell, because uber-hunter Dean just can’t seem to get it up any longer and do the job done. But because Sam loves Dean with all his heart, he will drag him along to ‘find the light’ and teach him that if he would just learn to embrace normal, he could find happiness, peace, and all the rewards gained in a life of repairing air conditioners and fixing plugged-up sinks…Dean could even get a girl like Amelia to make his life complete. Dean practices on living normal by cooking, decorating, and doing grocery shopping. (I think Dean made another misstep here, though, in giving Kevin the uppers and downers, because playing Suzy Homemaker is going to get pretty damned boring.) Sam might have even been rewarded with some of God’s power being sucked into his arm. I couldn’t really tell what that light was supposed to be.

    Sam brings the MoL and the Campbell side of hunting fully into play and Dean accepts his role as Sam’s helper. Sam throws Dean fans a bone by telling Dean he is the greatest hunter Sam knows. Thank you and FU, Mr. Carver.

    Dean’s purpose in this season and all previous seasons is to be a minor character whose POV is used to tell Sam’s hero stories.

    All in all, I would say that Carver was quite skilled, much more so than EK who took five years to do it, in using what he refers to as “perception” to screw Dean fans one more time.

    Comment by Sheri — February 15, 2013 @ 9:07 am

  7. @6 Sheri:

    You may have +5 internets for putting that into the simplest of terms.

    People are saying that Dean has these huge moments, killing the Whore, killing Eve, etc.

    But it’s just that 1 moment. Nothing contributing to the series.

    Carver, I’ll give credit, didn’t wait around to smash our hopes. You’re right. He cut us down fast. Nice and easy.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 15, 2013 @ 10:34 am

  8. jesus christ, you people on the rag or what?
    Hey lets try something new, how about CONSTRUCTIVE criticism huh? come on, all you people do is complain, isnt that exhausting. And you sheri, you love breaking balls so much why dont take your fanfics out and give some examples on what you would “contribute” to the plot.

    Comment by bob — February 15, 2013 @ 10:56 am

  9. And i meen details, come on enlighten us, with your great knowledge about a Fucking TV show. in its Eighth season.

    Comment by bob — February 15, 2013 @ 11:03 am

  10. You people are missing the point. Even the whole thing with Sam doing the trials is about Dean. The rest of this season will probably be about Dean learning that being a hunter doesn’t have to be grime and despair, that he can still have a good life, with “a light at the end of the tunnel.”
    Just like in season five. In season five, Sam’s choice of whether or not to accept Lucifer was obvious. Don’t accept Lucifer.
    But for Dean, it was a lot more difficult. And he had to wrestle with that for the whole season.
    In season six, Sam wasn’t even a character for the first half. He was just a sociopath. Again, the light is on Dean, as he has to figure out what to do. And damn if he didn’t get a lot of love that season, where he became a vampire and a grim reaper.
    Season seven, THE ENTIRE OSIRIS EPSIODE, the time travel episode where he meets Elliot Ness, and the Amazon episode were pretty much all about Dean. The epsiode with the killer clowns was also Dean heavy. He’s the one that saved the day when Sam was out getting chased by clowns, impotent to stop them.
    Do I have to go episode by episode by episode?
    Both characters get plenty of plot and development devoted to them. If one gets more, it’s probably Sam, because, let’s face it, the guy was the antichrist for most of the show. But it was still a pretty trivial difference.

    Comment by brx — February 15, 2013 @ 11:03 am

  11. And im just going to through these words out there:
    the CW and smallville for ten years. now that would guarantee quality.

    Comment by bob — February 15, 2013 @ 11:06 am

  12. @ bob: I don’t do fanfic, nor do I get paid the big bucks for writing a TV show. I would offer, though, that I one simple solution would be to plan a season that contains a story for each lead, since there tout that this show has two leads and is based on their abating love for each other. I wouldn’t be opposed to that.

    @ brx: What you have said in your post is exactly what Thomas A. and I have stated; that Sam carries the story and that his story is told through Dean’s POV and that occasionally Dean gets to do something. He should. They are paying Jensen millions a year to be there.

    What Dean learns or doesn’t learn this season is pure speculation. Nobody yet knows if any of that will be followed up on. There’s nine episodes left and they have several stories to wrap up: Sam’s trials, Cas’s Naomi business, the demon table and Crowley, probably something about Benny, and there will be stand-alones in there, too, I imagine. I don’t know if this week’s bestiality-based episode is a stand-alone or not, but I bet the upcoming Charlie one will be.

    Dean might learn something. Carver has a reputation from Being Human to give characters, even support characters, some growth each season. But at this point it’s just as easy to say that Carver has solidified his position in keeping Dean as a minor character who aids Sam in his quests (as I outlined).

    Comment by Sheri — February 15, 2013 @ 11:46 am

  13. Bob: It is a tv show. I recognize that. Take any other industry.
    A fast food restaurant has multiple products, and lets say people come for the Combo 1 and Combo 2. Both are a combo, with sides, but are different entres. Relate to Sam and Dean, both are different, but major characters.
    If this FF establishment takes Combo 1 (Dean) and shorts the fry size down, makes it not look as appealing, and does nothing to promote it, other than puttin it on the sign, will people want it? No. And those that do like the Combo 1 will bitch and complain that it got screwed over, and they will insist on giving it fair treatment because it is what they like.
    Especially if Combo 2 gets a free shake every couple months.
    Or they will go to a different FF place.

    Not quite the analogy I was hoping for, but in essentials, it gets the job done. I know the show is fake, nothing is real. But as a Dean fan, I am tired of his “moments” or glory. Exactly what did killing Eve accomplish? Besides no more Jefferson Starships walking around, they killed off a paycheck for the company.
    What did killing Ruby accomplish? Freeing the Devil, I’ll give you that, but again, he didn’t do that without Sam.
    I don’t hate Sam. At all. I’m glad that one of the brothers is doing these tasks, rather than Kevin, or Cas, or Charlie, Tom, Dick, or Harry. But why, why cant Dean go on his suicide run once, and let Sam have to worry about helping him?
    Instead of Sam taking the glory.
    S5 was about freewill vs destiny. The bros agreed to do it on their terms, yet Sam decides nah, I’ll say yes and try this new trick which requires demon blood, that s3 and s4 were all about.
    If the writers had wanted Dean’s story to go on, they wouldnt have brought back Adam. They would have let Dean and Sam have their almost fight, and then the Impala save they day.

    My loyalty to Dean lies with the fact that he is a big brother, like myself. Who is loyal to family, and does what it takes to get the job done.
    I can relate to him better than Sam.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 15, 2013 @ 12:03 pm

  14. Does anyone have an opinion about the clip? No. Okay, carry on then.

    Comment by Lisa1 — February 15, 2013 @ 2:36 pm

  15. O, come on… It’s like Dean is a support character, Jensen has nothing to act on so he’s getting paid his millions for nothing, and at the same time Dean Winchester is one of the most popular, favorite characters on TV today (according to any single poll out there). He is an iconic character by any mean. He is more popular than Sam (again, according to the internet surveys) . Isn’t it because Dean does have an underlying story 8 years in a row? Too bad you do not see it. He doesn’t have to slice a stupid hellhound’s throat to be a hero any more. Sam has to prove his good. Dean is a hero by definition. At least for me.
    About clip: love it. Can’t wait for next episode. Finally I can enjoy this show again.

    Comment by AAA — February 15, 2013 @ 3:01 pm

  16. Love the clips.

    Comment by CaseyT — February 15, 2013 @ 3:02 pm

  17. Well said all around AAA.

    Comment by CaseyT — February 15, 2013 @ 3:04 pm

  18. That clip was hilarious. Oh, I mean, damn it Sam gets the girl again. Just kidding couldn’t resist.

    Comment by AW — February 15, 2013 @ 3:10 pm

  19. Dean got the girl last week and this week Sam gets a girl dog…Well he had Madison the Wolflady a few seasons ago too.

    I hope neither brother has sex with this DOG.

    Comment by ozzie — February 15, 2013 @ 6:43 pm

  20. Dean’s story arc has always been, that he will do anything to protect Sam. That is who he is, who he has always been. Like he stated in As Time Goes By “If there is anything I can use to save Sam I will use it.”

    I just don’t understand how people can enjoy a show when they seem to hate one of the main characters. I love both characters, and the way J2 have played them, even with the not so good scripts.

    Dean is the one constant in the whole series. He will do anything to protect the ones he loves.

    HE IS A ROCK!!!!

    Comment by mj — February 15, 2013 @ 7:10 pm

  21. Sheri (#6): Excellent Post.

    Comment by SL — February 15, 2013 @ 8:10 pm

  22. i think this clip is hilarious. jensen ackles really brings his one line. and i can’t wait for sam’s response when he turns around and sees his dog has become a woman! i keep watching this clip and keep laughing.

    Comment by shandi — February 15, 2013 @ 8:22 pm

  23. Yes shandi, Me too. Sam looks so cute on this clip. I can’t wait for this episode. Season 8 is getting better and better.

    Comment by tammie edwards — February 15, 2013 @ 11:59 pm

  24. Supernatural will last 10 seasons like Smallville did… then I guess in 2015 it will be the real SPN SWAN for Sam going on this quest to shut the Hell’s Gate …it makes sense since he is Lucifer’s chosen and has still demon blood still in him.

    Plus I think that its Dean too who would be in charge of closing Heaven’s Gate to keep Demons out and that would explain why Dean has never been possessed by any demons and why Dean was the true vessel for Arc Angel Michael .

    I also think that Naomi wants the Hells Gate kept wide open too.

    Comment by ozzie — February 16, 2013 @ 8:26 am

  25. @AAA
    You should be ashamed of yourself. That’s an incredibly rude and insulting thing to say about Jared who has spent the last 8 years of his life playing Sam only to be known as the “less popular character” by extreme Dean fans. It’s so rude. What’s wrong with you? I don’t mind that Dean is more popular what bothers me is when Dean stans try to use that as a petty excuse to make the show all about Dean. What does popualarity have to do with anything? That was just unnecesary and rude.

    Comment by Ki — February 16, 2013 @ 4:51 pm

  26. Thank you, Ki. I 100% agree with you. A lot of Dean fans are the most nastiest hateful people I’ve ever encountered. No wonder I can’t stand Dean. Look at his pathetic excuse of fans.

    Comment by Jessica — February 16, 2013 @ 7:45 pm

  27. Jessica–Does that make it okay for other fans to hate Sam because of some Sam fans’ behavior? Truthfully, I see no logic in hating a fictional character because fans of that character say something you don’t like on the internet. That seems unnecessarily and ineffectively vindictive. Not to mention demeaning entire sections of fandom for the actions of others, whether they be Dean fans who say nasty things about Sam or Sam fans who try to call Dean fans pathetic, though, is fairly ridiculous.But I suppose if it makes you feel better, go for it.

    Comment by yeah — February 16, 2013 @ 8:25 pm

  28. Ki:O,that’s all you’ve got from my post? Then I am sorry, because you see what you want to see. I don’t know there did you find any Sam’s hate in there ( and btw I like Sam and I absolutely adore Jared and his work). I’ll try to clarify myself once: it’s OK to have Sam’s heavy episode (see post 1). It’s OK for Sam to have trials (see 160 posts of previous episode discussion). I do not have urgent needs for Dean to slice and dice any more, because he is a hero for me unconditionally. As long as two brothers work together and help each other – I don’t care who is doing final lethal shot. It’s a team work, always was and always be (I hope). If you don’t like what I write, agree to disagree or speak the truth in love. But don’t pronounce shame on me.

    Comment by AAA — February 17, 2013 @ 7:55 am

  29. @ Ki & Jessica:

    I would suggest that you actually ‘read’ what other people write in here.

    My God, that’s precisely what I meant in previous episode’s discussion thread… about the “Sam girls” vs “Dean girls” as well as the overreacting in response to other people’s posts.

    Comment by Aero — February 17, 2013 @ 8:16 am

  30. Dear Jessica it seems that you are as pathetic as us. What the hell is your problem?Dean girls do love Sam too. We do not assault Sam girls. Watch your tone and keep your pathetic hatred for your self.

    Comment by serenity — February 17, 2013 @ 8:31 am

  31. It is true that not all Dean/Jensen fans like Sam/Jared and same can be said about some Sam/Jared Fans too.

    I’am still waiting for an answer from Carver
    as to why Sam never looked for Dean in season 8.

    Comment by ozzie — February 17, 2013 @ 9:42 am

  32. Ki @25 and Jessica @26 you are the ones being abusive and rude.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 17, 2013 @ 10:50 am

  33. Post #26: YOU have ALWAYS been on this site a rude, pathetic excuse for an idiot.

    And you still are.

    Fact not fiction.

    Just shows, honestly, that some things do not improve with time….they rot.

    And that is how I feel about you.

    Comment by SL — February 17, 2013 @ 2:03 pm

  34. Haha. And it continues. Proves my point on how pathetic Dean fans are. I’m so glad I stopped coming here along time ago. I just casually lurk on here to see the pathetic anti-Sam posts that just make me laugh.

    Comment by Jessica — February 17, 2013 @ 3:17 pm

  35. SL–that’s really not any better than anything Jessica said.

    Jessica–Thanks for stopping in to stoop exactly to the level of the people you claim are pathetic. Any sense of superiority you might be harboring is misplaced, to put it mildly.

    Posters about other posters are boring, though, so I’ll do my part and stop acknowledging them.

    Sam was hilarious in this clip. I like that he still likes dogs and the little bit of Jared showing through there. I like that show is consistent with Dean’s dislike of dogs, and Sam freaking out because he knows Dean is going to be pissed was fun. Also, Sam’s babbling and Dean’s reaction to the woman lounging on the bed was fun. I needed this sort of sneak peek this week, so thank you, show.

    Comment by yeah — February 17, 2013 @ 3:24 pm

  36. Post #35: You are right. But it is exactly how I feel. Now she will slither back under her rock for a short while before popping back up to spread more vermin.

    I loved Dean’s reaction in the clip…now I would like to see Sam’s face as to what is waiting him in the room.

    Comment by SL — February 17, 2013 @ 8:30 pm

  37. I can well imagine what the drive to the hunt is going to be like if the dog has to ride with them. Any speculation on how the pup is going to react to Dean’s dislike of dogs? This episode is going to be loaded with humor.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 17, 2013 @ 9:18 pm

  38. oh wow, guys. It’s a TV show.. Not so nice to be insulting each other for this.

    I loved the clip. Hilarious and completely unexpected. Adoring the two now.

    Comment by Tammy — February 18, 2013 @ 4:05 am

  39. Real quick- Just wanna point out some of the Dean fans are straight men, like myself. Someone else referred to me as a she earlier lol

    Question: Did it say somewhere that they were going to shut the gates of heaven, or is that assumed and widely accepted?

    Comment by Thomas A — February 18, 2013 @ 4:48 pm

  40. Love the clip! LOL!

    Comment by xen — February 18, 2013 @ 7:13 pm

  41. No Thomas A, I think it was more or less assumed that if they could shut the gates of Hell then why not Heaven? The question that comes to mind is if the gates are closed does that mean people can not get in? Shouts of joy where Hell is concerned but for Heaven that’s a problem. Where does everyone go when they die? “Very interesting”

    Tell me I’m not the only one who remembers “Rowan And Martin’s Laugh In”

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 18, 2013 @ 8:36 pm

  42. @ Haley 56: The episode clearly had Dean saying that if the Gates of Hell could be closed before Elle died, her soul would not go to Hell. That leaves the entire question of where do people’s souls go when they die wide open.

    Comment by Sheri — February 18, 2013 @ 8:59 pm

  43. Sheri and Haley: If heaven’s gates are closed, does that lock angels in/out?

    Also, I would assume wandering souls would go to Purgatory.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 18, 2013 @ 11:50 pm

  44. So it’s the who gets more airtime argument again eh? Have you forgotten that the boys actually want time off? Especially Jared as he has a son now. Does it really matter who gets the most airtime? When you watched a movie like The Avengers, did you moan about how much airtime Stark got, or Thor got? No cuz it doesn’t really matter. If Jensen and Jared want more airtime they would say so. Oh and for those who just have to know, I’m a Winchester fan, aka a Dean AND Sam fan. As for this weeks episode it looks awesome!!! Can’t wait to see it!!! =D

    Comment by Dawgy — February 19, 2013 @ 3:39 am

  45. @ Thomas A: I don’t think there has been enough info yet about Heaven’s gates to know what happens with angels. Demons are human souls that eventually turn into demons in Hell (as Ruby tells Dean in Malleus Maleficarum), but what are angels? They are not made up of human souls, were made before humans, but somehow get their juice from human souls, have to have permission to possess a human body in order to manifest on Earth, and according to Cas, weren’t on Earth for 2000 (now 2004) years.

    It’s all murky to me, and I think the question becomes, does closing the gates of Heaven mean that human souls can no longer enter Heaven?

    Purgatory in SPNverse is only for monster souls and humans (because Dean’s body and soul went there) are either killed (?) by the monster souls or spit back out. From Family Matters:

    Sam: Purgatory.

    Dean: Purgatory? Purgatory’s real?

    Alpha Vampire: Oh, stupid cattle. Of course! And it is filled with the soul of every hungry thing like me that ever walked this earth.

    Edlund knew there was a giant plot hole looming when they decided to go with Dean in Purgatory, and that’s why he put this line in Blood Brothers.


    It does present a curious curl in the metaphysics, doesn’t it? If you murder a monster in monster heaven, where does it go?

    Comment by Sheri — February 19, 2013 @ 3:44 am

  46. IMO, closing the gates of Hell would have nothing to do with the gates of Heaven. Why would it? There’s no evidence that Heaven and Hell are intrinsically related, except as polar opposites.

    Now, Crowley’s revelation that there’s an angel tablet suggests some danger that Heaven’s gates might be closed (by his schemes), but that in and of itself seems bizarre, since why would God want Heaven closed off?

    On the other hand, maybe the angel tablet has more to do with angels and less with Heaven. If you remember back in “The End,” Cas told present-Dean that the angels had “vanished.” At the time, I assumed it was the little kid anti-Christ hand-waving them away, but maybe it could be this tablet…

    Comment by G-Dawg — February 19, 2013 @ 4:47 am

  47. Sam will not sacrifice Dean so the Gates of hell will not be closed. The angel tablet will let them discover all the crap naomi has been pulling with cas and Sam (from first half).

    Comment by AW — February 19, 2013 @ 8:54 am

  48. AW @47, The possibility of having to sacrifice someone to close the gates of Hell is mere speculation on our part. You’re jumping the gun a little on that point.

    G-Dawg @44, The argument isn’t about airtime but a lack of story line for Dean and being omitted from the myth-arc.

    G-Dawg @46, To my knowledge anyone has suggested that closing Hell’s gates will in any way affect Heaven but rather that the Angel Tablet MAY contain a method to close Heavens gates.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 19, 2013 @ 12:01 pm

  49. G-Dawg that’s supposed to read, “no-one”

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 19, 2013 @ 12:02 pm

  50. @ Haley 56 of course it is speculation but pretty obvious given the history of the show and of course the tendencies of God lore to favor sacrifice of family and the absolute serious consequences that would result from closing either or both gates would be worse than the apocalypse would have been. It just Gods way. IMO
    If the gates are closed I think every soul would be trapped on earth for eternity. Haunted houses everywhere. Sam and Dean would have to work overtime non-stopped dealing with vengefull spirits.

    Comment by AW — February 19, 2013 @ 2:04 pm

  51. AW @50, I’m not aware of Supernatural’s version of God demanding a human sacrifice. Can you point out that lore. Sam’s swan dive was of his own choosing not God’s. The Christian God of the real world called upon Abraham to sacrifice his son but stopped his hand. Never has a human being been sacrificed to God on his command but his own son.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 19, 2013 @ 3:26 pm

  52. except his own son @ Haley you answered yourself what other lore could there be. So far in supernatural God is a nonentity absent from all things.

    Comment by AW — February 19, 2013 @ 5:17 pm

  53. aww!!! squee!! sammy rubbing the doggies belly!! puddle of mud i am!! :D!!!!

    Comment by karen — February 19, 2013 @ 6:45 pm

  54. AW @52, this is becoming a theological debate and I will not do that. Here the conversation ends.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 19, 2013 @ 8:58 pm

  55. Gee sorry I didn’t know when did it become theological. Was it when we were talking about angels and demons, heaven and hell, God and his son, Michael and lucifer. I just cant see it. hmmm.

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 6:45 am

  56. might have been a little sarcasm dripping off my last post.bwa ha ha.

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 6:46 am

  57. AW @55, I was discussing the “Supernatural” universe. Though the writers have taken liberties in reference to the real “God” they are not likely to step so far as to suggest God would demand a human sacrifice for any reason.

    If you were of a similar mind set I apologize for my posting 54 and invite you to continue the discussion.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 20, 2013 @ 9:38 am

  58. @57 Haley ROFLMAO. Seriously. Try reading the good book. Um. Cain & Abel? Abraham & Isaac? Job’s family? That little thing called “the flood”? The plagues of Egypt? Uh. God’s pretty big on asking or demanding sacrifices. I could go on…

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 9:57 am

  59. @57 Haley 56 I only speculate on the supernatural univers on these boards. I was thinking of how Michael was going to kill licifer, even in 2014 lucy was wearing Sam when he killed Dean from 2014. So its out there they like to try to force Sam and Dean to kill each other. Thats all I was trying to say. I will never try to use these boards to teach evolution to creationists. It just doesn’t seem appropriate. I do enjoy healthy debates however.

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 10:18 am

  60. lucifer not licifer WTH!

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 10:20 am

  61. I do think Bob’s comment earlier had a ring of truth. I’d love to hear what plots you guys would like to see. Or even details about the show that you love and want to see more of. I know I’ve been bitching about the set dressing – but haven’t mentioned how insanely awesome the batcave is – especially the library. They totally got that right. All that beautiful burnished wood. Plus, just like in the ‘heavenly green room’ they used iron scrollwork to give a really beautiful, simple design element to help define the space. They distinguished the lighting to make it feel like a home, but still low enough to feel in line with the rest of the show.

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 11:29 am

  62. @AW lickifer? Hmm. Freudian slip.

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 11:30 am

  63. ha!

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 11:34 am

  64. @AW – so what do you think about Dean’s burgers? Sam seems addicted, so maybe he’s putting demon blood in them?

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 12:54 pm

  65. @t1gerlilly those looked like some very tasty burgers. Maybe the beef comes from demon cows, hmmm do cows go to hell. hahaha. maybe Dean stuffed Sams burger with some of those uppers so he can study those archives.

    Comment by AW — February 20, 2013 @ 2:01 pm

  66. AW @59, A misunderstanding on my part for which I apologize. I do enjoy a good debate myself but as we have both said this is not the place for one on such a subject.

    t1gerlilly @58, What pray tell does ROFLMAO mean or what is it in reference to?

    Cain sacrificed vegetables and Able lambs not human-beings. God called upon Abraham to sacrifice his son but stopped his hand (It was a test of faith and obedience was already mentioned.) and Job was never called upon to sacrifice anyone. AW and I were discussing literal human sacrifice to God.

    I am exceedingly well versed in the Bible and in history. Your remark “Seriously. Try reading the good book.” was condescending and uncalled for.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 20, 2013 @ 2:27 pm

  67. @Haley – ok I didn’t want to go there, but since you decline to recognize the bloodthirsinrss of wholesale destruction and random smitage as forms of human sacrifice – I don’t see as I have any choice.
    Jesus Christ. Sacrificed for our sins – to redeem us from original sin. You know, no one ever seems to ask what he was saving us from – which was god’s wrath that damned us all into the pit – supposedly because a couple of naked idiots went and ate an apple. Not even two apples – they just shared one. And for that he required that his only son be tortured and killed. Hell, let’s not even get into the whole issue of cannibalism, since if you’re a good catholic, then by virtue of transubstantiation, you’re eating the actual flesh and blood of Jesus every week.
    The point I’m trying to make is that there’s pretty much nothing horrible that the SPN writers or any of us commenting here could come up with that the Bible can’t top. I wasn’t being condescending – I was just directing you to a relevent text on the subject.

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 3:17 pm

  68. @58: Never, in the exception of Issac, and I can debate that one too, were any sacrifices of human kind DEMANDED. Let us observe:

    1)Cain and Abel: One brother slew the other brother out of jealousy. God never said “Hey man, go kill your brother.” Free will, and jealousy. That’s all there.

    2)Abraham and Issac: To Abraham, it looked like a demand. To God, it was a test. He never intended for Issac to die. It was just to see if Abraham was loyal. Which he was.

    3)Job’s family: Again, a test. Job was put through so many troubles, yet stayed loyal to God. This was a test of faith, not a demand for human sacrifice.

    4)The little thing called “the flood”: God told Noah to go forth and build an ark. To preserve the creations of God, using selection of those creations deemed pure and good in the eyes of God. The wickedness of man had come up in the eyes of the Lord, and he wished to purge the wickedness from the face of the Earth. The flood was punishment. God didn’t call for all people to be sacrificed. He wanted to punish them for not doing what he wanted of them.

    5)The Plagues: These were punishments to the Egyptians, led by Pharaoh, and dictated by Moses. The Egyptians (hereby abbreviated as Egy) had enslaved the Jews, who were the chosen people of God. Moses told Pharaoh to let them go, and Pharaoh said no. So Moses told him that plagues would come. Pharaoh kept saying no, and the plagues kept a-rollin’. Never once did God say “I demand you die to frogs and fire and darkness and that you sacrifice up the firstborn.” Moses pleaded with Pharaoh everytime, and again, Pharaoh said no. God gave them options to change their mind, and the Egy said no.

    You seem to be misinformed of what a sacrifice is. The only sacrifice I can think of is Cain and Abel, when they had to bring forth fruit of the earth to God. One brought something grandiose, the other brought the bare minimum. The only other sacrifice was of Jesus, of course.

    Please tell me an occasion where God said “Go, bring me this or that or this person, and kill them for my appeasement.”

    Matthew 9:13 But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy, not sacrifice.’ For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”

    Mark 12:33 To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.”

    Isaiah 1:11 “The multitude of your sacrifices–what are they to me?” says the LORD. “I have more than enough of burnt offerings, of rams and the fat of fattened animals; I have no pleasure in the blood of bulls and lambs and goats.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 20, 2013 @ 3:18 pm

  69. @Thomas A – A case where god said go and kill some people for my appeasement? And killing the firstborn of everybody because they had a crappy ruler doesn’t count?Or killing an entire family just to win a bet with Satan? How ’bout Sodom and Gamorrah?
    Or the destruction of Canaan?

    Israel Warned of the Idolatry of Canaan
    Ex. 34.11-17
    1 When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Gir’gashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Per’izzites, and the Hivites, and the Jeb’usites, seven nations Acts 13.19 greater and mightier than thou;
    2 and when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor show mercy unto them:
    Plus he told David to go kill the Philistines.
    And on and on… It’s true he forbade offerings as a form of idolatry, but the evil in human sacrifice is the unnessecary loss of human life at the direction of a deity. Honestly, from that perspective – Christianity has killed a lot more people than all the pagan sacrifices put together.
    Plus- read the lives of the saints. Now THERE is enough horror to shiver your bones on the warmest summer night. Martyrdom is just another name fo sacrifice if you ask me

    Comment by t1gerlilly — February 20, 2013 @ 3:57 pm

  70. T1gerllily @67. AW and I were discussing human beings sacrificing other human beings to God on God’s command. That’s it, that’s all, nothing more.

    I saw no quotes relevant or otherwise in either of your posts 58 and 67 but rather an abundance of opinions on unrelated events in the old testament.

    I will address only a few of your statements as Thomas A has already responded so well to most.

    In my extensive studies of the Bible I have never found anything random in God’s actions. It helps if you are a student of history and apply a little logic.

    Adam and Eve where not banished for taking a few bites out of an apple. Adam was given a companion, a partner however when said partner asked to come with him to be with God he said no. She asked repeatedly but was constantly denied the privilege of being with God or having any purpose other than waiting for Adam to come back.

    When Lucifer saw her growing in discontent he informed her that the reason God said not to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge was because knowledge would make her as powerful as God. After tolerating all the rejection and denial she would Eve took the fruit. Eve’s sin was the desire to be God like.

    Adam on the other hand neglected his partner’s needs and most of all denied her God and his guidance and finely took the fruit without question or even thinking about it.

    For the sin of seeking equality with God Eve’s one God like power, childbirth, would forever more be accompanied by pain and blood and Adam for refusing to share his privileged relationship with God and neglecting his partner would spend the rest of his life caring for her needs.

    Finely they chose knowledge over innocence and thus were no longer able to live as children with their every need provided for. The punishment suited the crimes and the crimes where selfishness, neglect, and the quest for power.

    I would like to add to Thomas A’s response to Job that God merely agreed to step back and let Lucifer try to turn Job against God. It was Lucifer that did all the damage. Also please note that Job was rewarded by having everything he lost replaced.

    My own addendum to the plagues of Egypt would be to point out that the final plague, the death of the first born was not chosen by Moses or God. The Pharaoh was warned that he would determine the final plague and the Pharaoh responded by deciding to kill the first born of Israel.

    You may place all violence and death in the Bible at God’s doorstep but I do not. I will take a moment to revisit Cain and Able.

    When God called Cain to account for killing his brother. (Able’s offerings were willing and out of love and so were accepted while Cain’s offerings reluctant and resentful and therefore were not. He saw God’s reaction as favoritism and in a jealous fit ‘rose up and slue Able’) God told Cain to go to the east of Eden into the land of Nod where “Mayst yeah shall choose good over evil.” I repeat “mayst and choose”. We were given freedom of choice. God will not interfere in the choice of any man. Where mankind has gone or will go from that point on is on us not God.

    “Seriously. Try reading the good book.” I have read the good book quite extensively

    ” ok I didn’t want to go there, but since you decline to recognize the bloodthirsinrss of wholesale destruction and random smitage as forms of human sacrifice” I do recognize a great deal of bloodthirstiness and whole sale destruction and smitage however I question who is to be held accountable and for what.

    Comment by Haley 56 — February 20, 2013 @ 6:17 pm

  71. Tigerlilly @69:

    S&G (the destruction of a city with raining fire): This was a punishment for the people who did not act in accordance with God’s word. They sinned. God sought the righteous in the city, and told them that if you can find some enough good people in the town, I’ll spare it from my wrath. Wrath not being a sacrifice, but a punishment. God kept lowering the number until it was just 1. If just 1 person could be found good to God, He would spare it. But no, they couldn’t be found, so he destroyed the city. Lot’s wife disobeyed and looked back, so he turned her to salt.

    Let me make it easier to understand:

    If your dad says, don’t touch the cookies. And you dont touch them. You get rewarded with cookies later.

    If you touch them and he finds out, which in this case, he has the whole house wired with cameras and can see anything: he will punish you. Don’t do as you are told by your dad, and he will punish you.

    You are confusing punishment/anger with sacrifice.
    Sacrifice is an offering given to something/someone to appease them, and prevent them from becoming angry.

    The punishment you mentioned is God’s wrath for disobeying him. So the only sacrifice you can mention is MAYBE sacrificing our worldy ways to gain entry to Heaven. Not a sacrifice of human flesh, blood, and bone on an alter as a ritual to gain favor to God.

    Seriously: Read the good book in context.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 21, 2013 @ 10:01 am

  72. Tigerlilly: I overlooked your mention about how sacrificing has cost less lives than killing in the name of God.

    God NEVER commanded for the Crusades to kill people to make him happy. People assumed that because all religion wasn’t unison and for God, that other religions were wrong and deserved to be destroyed. And Pagan sacrifices existed before we started tracking them. People making offerings to their “rain gods” or “sun gods” or “harvest gods.”

    Once again, you are choosing what to see. People doing actions out of free will does not constitute as a sacrifice. The 10 Commandments: Thou shalt not kill. What a waste of stone tablet, if God wanted us to kill for him.

    Free will allowed evil into the hearts of man, and evil from Satan. God gave us free will instead of forcing us to serve him. Free will is our own actions, not actions preplanned or commanded by God.

    Martyrdom is NOT the same as a sacrifice to God. And their are different martyrs, and different saints too. If you believe everything you read about Saints, then Saint George killed a dragon, melted his armor, and put the fears of all of the kingdom into a box made from the melted armor.

    Comment by Thomas A — February 21, 2013 @ 10:20 am

  73. t1gerlily, you are confusing capital punishment with human sacrifice. Although, I see from your post that you equate them, here is a Christian’s perspective.

    So the question is why did the Israelites destroy cities and kill all of the people inside?

    The first part is the easy to understand: because that’s what armies did. They went to war with their enemies. They were bloody wars of destruction. In this case, God used his people to execute his judgment against the nations and their exceedingly wicked practices.

    Isn’t that unfair? Well, Christians believe that God has a right to judge everyone. Punishing the sinful is a big theme in the Bible. In fact, compared to God’s holiness, there is no such thing as an “innocent” person. All have sinned (Romans 3:23), and the penalty for sin is death (Romans 6:23). God has just cause to wipe us all out; the fact that He doesn’t is proof of His mercy. –see Noah and his family and the city of Ninevah, Lot’s family. The people in Noah’s time had 100 years to repent and they mocked instead.
    “God saw…every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time.” Gen 6

    Sometimes, an act of judgment on one is often an act of mercy for another: the plagues were judgment on the Pharaoh’s unbelief but also a means of liberating Israel. Likewise, the destruction of the Canaanites was an act of mercy for Israel.

    Also Israel’s possession of the land and the people there being kicked out were not due to Israel’s righteousness, but clearly it was a punishment for the wickedness of the people.

    Deut 9:5. It is not because of your righteousness or integrity that you are going to take possession of the land but on account of the wickedness of these nations, the Lord your God will drive them out before you to accomplish what he swore to your fathers, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

    God frequently tells Israel that if they do not follow the Lord then they will suffer the same fate as the nations being “vomited” out of the land “otherwise they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the LORD your God.”

    As to sacrifices, the Israelites were warned time and time again against the human sacrifice that was practiced by many of their enemies. Particularly child sacrifice.

    “You shall not give any of your children to offer them to Molech, and so profane the name of your God: I am the Lord.”

    Seems God’s concerns were valid…
    Jeremiah 7:31
    “And they have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, which I did not command, nor did it come into my mind.”

    The Israelites had a very complex system of sacrifices and offerings. Christians believe that these were pictures of the sacrifice that Christ would make for us–a perfect lamb without spot or blemish. They are several words in the Hebrew language that are translated “sacrifice” in the English language; some have the connotation of consecration and service and being given over to God, not all necessarily mean being put to the fire.

    To summarize, during the Old Testament period, God called a physical nation. He instructed them to take their promised land. They were to drive out the inhabitants and raze the culture–part of this was the elimination of the wicked Canaanite culture from the Promised Land. A physical nation which had physical battles and possessed a physical land.

    Today, our battles are spiritual. Since the death of Christ, Christians believe that we have a new relationship with God through his Son. The old sacrifices have given way to us presenting ourselves to God today as “living sacrifices.”

    Comment by inky — February 21, 2013 @ 4:57 pm

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